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Ted Ligety: Giant Slalom (GS) Skier's Unique Turning

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31#
发表于 2014-12-17 20:55:43 | 只看该作者
本帖最后由 bullpower 于 2014-12-17 20:57 编辑

俺觉得纯CARVING小弯,半径不够小,HANDLE不了下面录像里的TERRAIN, SNOW CONDITION, 和TURN SHAPE

32#
发表于 2014-12-17 20:57:00 | 只看该作者
bullpower 发表于 2014-12-17 20:30
还请详解一下LEG ROTATION,最好能在家平地上做个动作放上来。

CSIA的STEERING我略知一二,

你老师的说法, 我不懂, 你还是去问你的老师.

Leg Totation下次咱们坡上比划比划.
33#
发表于 2014-12-17 21:31:41 | 只看该作者
本帖最后由 cat 于 2014-12-17 21:32 编辑

马达君眼光精准见识独到自不必说,文字上的造诣更是卓尔不群,一看便是科班出身,远非一干理工猥琐男所能望尔项背。放眼雪坛,技术上唯教授尚可与你打个平手,但文字表述上他就...貌似他法文好过英文又好过中文...总之...不说也罢,而老牛虽然文字表述是中年国移里面最好的,但技术理解上却太过拘泥不化喜好掉书包终是差了一点

总之,写了这么多,只是想给马达君打打气,觉得马达君唯一有所缺憾的,便是自信。观君每每发帖,洋洋洒洒数千言,又兼图文并茂自制视频,无贴而不可自成置顶加精之高楼也!却又何故自甘居人屋檐下?唯自信不足,妄自菲薄尔!君却不知,君之低调隐忍,令真知灼见埋没于荒山野岭,实乃劳苦大众之大不幸也!甚憾,甚憾,扼腕,扼腕
34#
发表于 2014-12-17 21:42:07 | 只看该作者
本帖最后由 bullpower 于 2014-12-17 21:45 编辑

老大以前卖过一本书,我倾家荡产给买下了。 现在拿出来在看看。
新感想就是EXTENSION不是说就非得伸直了,而是伸直的过程, UNBENDING,LENGTHING 不是 STRAIGHTENING

TERMINOLOGY
Angulation: the lateral angles formed between segments of the body.
Balance: the use of the neuromuscular system to maintain an athletic posture and alignment of
the COM and BOS.

Banking: the tipping of the shoulders and the upper body into the turn. It generally is an unstable
position, and it is often associated with rotation. Synonym: tipping.
Base of Support (BOS): the area between all points that support the body. It generally is referred
to as the feet, but it is any point of snow contact including skis and poles.

Carving: turns with little or no skidding, with the tails of the skis following the tracks made by
the tips.

Christie: a turn or part of a turn, done with the skis parallel.

Centre of Mass (COM): the three dimensional balance point of an object.

Counter-rotation: the action of upper and lower body turning against each other, based on
physical principle of an action having an equal and opposite reaction. If upper or lower body are
turned, the other segment will turn in the opposite direction. A weak force and most effective if
the skis are un-weighted.

Cross-over: the crossing of the trajectories of the COM and BOS between turns; related to edge
change.

Edge angle: the lateral angle formed between the base of the ski and the slope.

Edge change: the change of balance from one edge (or edges) to the other.

Extension: the lengthening of the body by un-bending joints. Opposite of flexion.

Fall Line: an imaginary line following the inclination of the slope at any point. Where a snowball
would roll if released on the slope.

Flexion: the shortening of the body by bending joints. Opposite of extension.

Inclination: the degree of lean used to balance against the external forces generated by turning.
Lead change: the natural tendency for the inside ski to be ahead as a result of the lower body
turning.

Line of motion: the path that the COM follows.

Linking: the smooth transition between turning arcs. Related to edge change.

Movement: body actions initiated by internal muscular efforts. Can affect balance on all planes.

Parallel: a position of the skis where the longitudinal axes are parallel and edge angles are the
same.

Rotation: the twisting of the hips or upper body into the turn, often causing imbalance.

Self steering of skis: the inherent turning tendency of skis, due to sidecut and longitudinal flex.

Separation (upper and lower body): refers to the steering effort being led by the lower body,
with the upper body naturally facing the direction of travel, or the tangent of the arc.


Sidecut: the shape of the ski defined by the width underfoot versus width tip and tail.

Ski reaction: the use of stored energy in ski and boot to provide rebound for turn linking.

Skidding: the sideways travel of one or both skis across the snow. Necessary for speed control.

Sliding: the forward travel of one or both skis on the snow.

Steering: the blend of edging and pivoting with the control of the resulting pressure. Steering
allows the skier to choose a variety of turn shapes. Different blends of edging and pivoting allow
the skier to control speed or to maintain speed or accelerate by reducing braking.


Steering angle: the angle formed between the longitudinal axis of the ski and the direction of
travel of the skier.

Stem: a position of the skis where the tails are further apart than the tips. Seen in Wedge
(snowplow) turns as a braking or steering device, or if the tail of the downhill ski skids more than
the tip.

Stepping: a step, or transferring of weight from one ski to the other.

Tipping: the tipping of the shoulders and upper body into the turn. Generally unstable position,
and often associated with rotation. Synonym: banking.

Traverse: sliding forward on edges at angle to the fall line.

Wedge: ski position with tips together and tails apart. See Stemming.

Weighting/Unweighting: the control of the load or pressure against the snow. Affected by
moving COM quickly up or down, by increasing or reducing steering, and by the muscular forces
applied by the skier.
35#
发表于 2014-12-17 21:53:29 | 只看该作者
cat 发表于 2014-12-17 21:31
马达君眼光精准见识独到自不必说,文字上的造诣更是卓尔不群,一看便是科班出身,远非一干理工猥琐男所能望 ...

猫大欲使吾居炉火上耶?险恶啊险恶。俄还是闭嘴吧。
36#
发表于 2014-12-18 09:24:03 | 只看该作者
checkmoteur 发表于 2014-12-17 20:42
大师,俄一个就学了点初级c,不懂物理的文科生,写大字报的主儿,嫩一笑而过就好,don't take what I've  ...

不转腿也能Steering,请看扭转36式之第四式:
推转 http://skichinese.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=9009

High C搓不搓雪,可以暂且放下,慢慢等观念的变化
37#
发表于 2014-12-18 10:08:09 | 只看该作者
本帖最后由 bullpower 于 2014-12-18 10:09 编辑
IntoTheWind 发表于 2014-12-18 09:24
不转腿也能Steering,请看扭转36式之第四式:
推转 http://skichinese.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid ...


是要后坐吗, 后坐板也转不动的, 甭管转脚还是转腿,
只要不CENTRE ,板头或板尾压雪里, 那么长的力臂, 哪儿使劲都转不过来的!

PIVOTING POINT 就在脚正中间, 最有效,雪的阻力距最小

检测的办法就是进MOGUL, 如果不CENTRE , 就只有屁刹一条路.

点评

someone asked earlier about the def of CENTRED, answering that question would answer some of yours ;)  发表于 2014-12-18 11:58
38#
发表于 2014-12-18 10:19:47 | 只看该作者
IntoTheWind 发表于 2014-12-18 09:24
不转腿也能Steering,请看扭转36式之第四式:
推转 http://skichinese.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid ...

大师,俄相信这里讨论的steering,已特别限定是C或扩大一点说,北美滑雪技术意义下的steering了吧。那么上边牛老板引用的那个terminology里,给出的界定是很清楚的:

Steering: the blend of edging and pivoting with the control of the resulting pressure。

那么大师说不转腿也可以的steering,一定不是这里讨论的steering。歪?因为不转腿的pivoting,如何可能。

当然上下身一起转,也可以pivoting。那是初学者头几次上雪的低级动作,应不在这样的讨论范围之内。

俄脚的大师不必过于执着所谓steering的准确定义是嘛。C把这个movement称为steering其自身,就不像是要追求准确定义的。这是rather描绘性的,甚至只是描绘了一种感觉。总之第一这一定是pivoting or转腿,却不是推脚跟的转腿,而是pointing脚趾头的转腿。第二这一定不是原地转,而是向前往外的延伸出去的转,因为还要blend edging。

或谓推脚跟与pointing脚趾头,结果是一样的啊;人在滑雪,也总是向前向外的,即便原地pivoting。双兔傍地走,安能辨我是雄雌?

其实还是有区别,可以感受到区别的。具备这个感受能力,也不需要多么艰苦的训练或超人的悟性。俄自己来说,上季末集中培训了三天,本季初断续培训了8天,每天4个小时上下,也就差不多具备这个能力。or rather,已具备足够的幽默感,放弃对steering的准确定义的追求了。

第一你知道什么对的,第二你努力做对,就完了呗。这就是有人教有人纠正,胜过自己琢磨的好处。

大师,是时候了。

点评

查大大自己玩吧,哥扯呼了  发表于 2014-12-18 10:42
不那么就事论事的应该不是我吧,哈哈  发表于 2014-12-18 10:37
这样就事论事不挺好的么  发表于 2014-12-18 10:30
39#
发表于 2014-12-19 22:22:56 | 只看该作者
bullpower 发表于 2014-12-17 20:30
还请详解一下LEG ROTATION,最好能在家平地上做个动作放上来。

CSIA的STEERING我略知一二,


刚好看到了一个Leg Rotation的例子, 圣牛学习学习

http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t/Ski/31298809.html

看这位这熟练程度, 要想跳出来, 可不容易了
40#
发表于 2014-12-19 22:51:32 | 只看该作者
本帖最后由 bullpower 于 2014-12-19 23:08 编辑
IntoTheWind 发表于 2014-12-19 22:22
刚好看到了一个Leg Rotation的例子, 圣牛学习学习

http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t/Ski/31298809.html


滑的好拍的也好!

这位滑的就是EMMA同雪的增强版, 毕竟她滑了6-7年了, EMMA只滑了一年。



同时也是小北同雪向左转时的增强版。

套用NATE话讲, 就是一个P3刹车接一个P3刹车。
好多的SKIDDING。

我给她的把脉, TURN WITH LOWER BODY 不够
恰恰是LEG ROTATE的还不够,1 不够强, 板转的不横, 2不够SMOOTH

其他问题需要正面看,才能看到,背面不容易看到(没训练过),同时又很晃

不过解释NATE原话的最佳视频是我第一次上双黑。从1分27秒开始看

当然视频里的MM比我滑的从容点,可坡也缓啊, 嘿嘿。。。。

但MM滑雪没A腿, 秒杀我!

点评

EMMA同学在陷阱边上,你给推一把就下去了  发表于 2014-12-20 08:58
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